Centrifugal supercharger

[Tonymac]

i do understand how a turbo works and if you know anything at all you wouldent make yourself sound so ignorant bottom line superchargers run cooler and they are less harmfull on your enjin

Thanks for the insult.

Since you hate hearing it from me, this is a quote from the faq page at Perfect Power (a EMS and piggyback controller manufacturer):

Superchargers are heating the boost air to the same extent as a Turbocharger, but the fitting of intercoolers is hardly every done to the roots type.

They're ignorant on "enjins" too I guess right?

As far as harm goes, boost is boost d00d. Just b/c SC'd cars tend to peak at lower RPM's doesn't mean SC's are less harmful. The higher you rev, the more harm you're doing to your "enjin" and turbo'd cars tend rev higher - not b/c of the the turbo though. Instead, its due to the "enjins" usually being smaller displacement which usually means higher revving straight from the factory. Talk to turbo diesel owner and ask him when he shifts gears though. Oh and while you're at it, ask him how many miles he expects to put on his "enjin".

 

[etxxz]

^^ :laugh: how can you compare performance aspired engines to something that is specifically engineered to have torque in the low rpms and probably not meant to rev past 4500. you are deeply confused in the definitions of power and torque. google horsepower vs torque.

and how about someone looks up info. there are courses, entire books, companies and even NASA has a branch for the study of fluid dynamics, heat transfer and thermodynamics of Turbo machinery

so WTF do any of us know about any of this. show some credentials and then explain...this argument smells!

Heat exchange from radiant heat is what you're talking about? Negligible.

this is definetly not neglegible...there's truth in your friend's argument from his observation that turbochargers are subject to the high temperature of exhaust gases, hence all turbo require cooling and notice that most turbo cars (if not all idk) are intercooled while most supercharged cars (stock atleast) are not. FACT.

put your hand next to an turbo glowing orange and how it'll taste like chicken in a minute. now, even though there's a lot of air quickly flowing in and out of the turbo (maybe explains your "negleglible" response), it takes a hell of a lot of work energy to compress a gas and who knows what the efficiency of xxx turbo is. so there, it reqs even MORE energy


conclusions: none.
point of argument = null.
point of thread: highjacked!!!

... You're taking this heat thing out of proportion. Robbing an engine of power to make power is far worse....

this turns into an efficiency issue so this statement is not always correct. but yes the heat thing is out of proportion.

 

[Tonymac]

^^ :laugh: how can you compare performance aspired engines to something that is specifically engineered to have torque in the low rpms and probably not meant to rev past 4500. you are deeply confused in the definitions of power and torque. google horsepower vs torque.

and how about someone looks up info. there are courses, entire books, companies and even NASA has a branch for the study of fluid dynamics, heat transfer and thermodynamics of Turbo machinery

so WTF do any of us know about any of this. show some credentials and then explain...this argument smells!

Did you even read the arguement? I'm trying to convey the point that a turbo can a) create boost early on and b) not cause harm to an engine. It's diffucult to argue or create a point when someone says some shit so rediculous that you don't know where to even begin. I know exactly how hp is calculated and don't need google to teach me, thanks.

this is definetly not neglegible...there's truth in your friend's argument from his observation that turbochargers are subject to the high temperature of exhaust gases, hence all turbo require cooling and notice that most turbo cars (if not all idk) are intercooled while most supercharged cars (stock atleast) are not. FACT.

FACT, most turbocharged vehicles run higher boost levels than most supercharged vehicles hence their not coming with intercoolers from the factory. I'm going by every bit of information I've ever read from Maximum boost to random sites (such as the one I quoted). The truth is, until one of us measures intake temperatures at the throttle body of both a turbo and supoercharger creating equal boost pressure, we'll never be 100% and even then we couldn't be sure due to the different compressors.

put your hand next to an turbo glowing orange and how it'll taste like chicken in a minute. now, even though there's a lot of air quickly flowing in and out of the turbo (maybe explains your "negleglible" response), it takes a hell of a lot of work energy to compress a gas and who knows what the efficiency of xxx turbo is. so there, it reqs even MORE energy

What requires more energy? You lost me at chicken.

this turns into an efficiency issue so this statement is not always correct.

Bullshit it's not. Show me a belt driven sc that does not rob power.

but yes the heat thing is out of proportion.

Then shut the fuck up!

 

[Ka-Tony]

:laugh: @ "dumb ass mother fucker trying to be cute"

 

[StealthFighter1]

omg , both are mostly the same in my book , i'm into all kinds of cars ( owned 64 imapla at one point ) and the O.G.s agree that ''fuel injection is nice , but i'd rather get blown '' haha most systems depend on the particular needs / settup / and budget / but lots of grassroots guys actually go sc rather than turbo due to simplicity = less headaches , centrifugals in my book are the best of both worlds , i once wanted to boost a 96 chevy tahoe i had with a centrifugal / intercooled system that made only about 130hp more but made like 230tq more ... yeah that would have been 390hp and 560tq .... on 7 psi and it started from 2500rpm to the raised 6000rpm redline.... (oh and you could upgrade to a 10-12 psi pulley which made about 200hp and 300+ tq = 460hp and 630tq without exhaust modifications and still out of a factory airbox..... NUTS!!! ) EDIT: stock hp was 260 and tq was 330

in this case the turdbo/ superblower debate is kinda like arguing about which icecream flavor is better... they're all good buddy, they're all good.

( i still love to hear crazy N/A motors too though...)

 

[PlatanoDrifter]

+1 i love lod ass n/a motors but boost sounds nice too

 

[auroras13]

Heat exchange from radiant heat is what you're talking about? Negligible.

lol you gonna sit there and write that i wrote "enjin" wrong you wrote negligable you ass and this was never mant to be an argument and this heat thing did go way out there i was just trying to post somthing new and good job on findin somthing about how hot superchargers get cus i was looking for that info for days

 

[Tonymac]

lol you gonna sit there and write that i wrote "enjin" wrong you wrote negligable you ass

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA...*breathe*...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Dictionary.com it if you have to genius. I spelled it correctly.

pwnd

:boring:

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1) - Cite This Source
neg‧li‧gi‧ble  /ˈnɛglɪdʒəbəl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[neg-li-juh-buhl] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
so small, trifling, or unimportant that it may safely be neglected or disregarded: The extra expenses were negligible.
[Origin: 1820–30; < L neglig(ere) to neglect + -ible]

—Related forms
neg‧li‧gi‧bil‧i‧ty, neg‧li‧gi‧ble‧ness, noun
neg‧li‧gi‧bly, adverb
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.

 

[auroras13]

then you shouldent have even yoused that word i thought you ment to write negotiable you inane fuck decause its a big amount of heat exchange for your o2 sensor to work you have to worm the car up to at least 600 degrees so go figure wut the temp is at operating temp why dont you put a little thermometer on a turbo and drive it around

 

[Tonymac]

I know how hot a turbo gets. I got a 2000+deg coating from HPC on my turbine housing for a reason (and my manifold). When a turbo is designed though, heat factors (amongst others) are taken into consideration. Ever notice how a chra stays its normal color when the trubine sitting right on it is glowing hot - near melting? The back side of compressor housings have fins 99% of the time too. Not to mention each casting, from the trubine to the chra to the compressor housing is made with completely different materials. Recently, Garrett started using very high levels of nickel in the turbine housings to keep the heat where it needs to be (on GT series turbine housings - which is what I have). Engineers do their homework.

Straight from the horse's mouth:

Following a hot shutdown of a turbocharger, heat soak begins. This means that the heat in the head, exhaust manifold, and turbine housing finds it way to the turbo’s center housing, raising its temperature. These extreme temperatures in the center housing can result in oil coking.

Not during operation. Oil and water are a turbo's friend. This isn't to say there will be no heat exchange, just that you are blowing things waaay out of proportion.

 

[tpdrifter]

y dont we all jus go n/a.

 

[auroras13]

you know wut ill be the bigger man your right i dont even know the point of this argument you you will get your trophy in 2-3 days

 

[alibaba]

oh man that was awsome,
i dont think ive ever had so much reading reading 3 pages of non-stop arguing

 

[auroras13]

i try

 

[m4nfred]

auroras....stop being rude please....no insuts needed..... and doridori, lets try to stay cool......RELAX PEOPLE...please

and lets be serious.........na is best

 

[tpdrifter]

Thank U...... The Only Way I'll Ever Get A Turbo Is If I Find Another 240 Wit An Sr Abanded In The Warehouse Wer I Live.

 

[green_machine]

diddo to that

im just suggesting somthing if it make you feel better inside to turnthis into an argument well go tick fot tat all day this is an argument thats been going on for 20 years and for your info its not the same for turbos cheak your facts there must be a typo turbos run at high rpms and super chargers run at low witch takes it easyer on you internals

dude, you're wrong. a turbo spins at higher rpms than a roots style supercharger. The one's you're talking about use almost the same compressor as a turbo so in order to work efficient they have to be at high rmps. the engine rpms dont have to go any higher than stock. Boost is boost whether it's from a supercharger or turbo it's not good for the engine.

and the reason most stock supercharged cars aren't intercooled is because they dont use centrifugal superchargers, they use roots style that bolt to the intake manifold leaving minimum room to run intercooler piping.

turbo > superchargers .... unless routing piping and exhaust and chargepipes are almost impossible or a pain in the ass(think camero, mustang, corvette, not a 4cyl with a foot of clearence for the turbo) but they have a cure for that as well.... rear mount turbo

 

[auroras13]

yeah i agree with you on allot of thing you just said its that at first this was about Centrifugal supercharger then dori turned it into something else i ment that about the roots type and yes and type of forced induction is going to damage your car thats inevitable

 

[Tonymac]

yeah i agree with you on allot of thing you just said its that at first this was about Centrifugal supercharger then dori turned it into something else i ment that about the roots type and yes and type of forced induction is going to damage your car thats inevitable

I didn't turn it into anything. You keep mentioning a supercharger/turbocharger debate - I never debated between the two. You posted up some psuedo-scientific myth about heat to which I commented.

As for boost damaging your engine, that's just not true at all - to an extent. Of course you can't pull off your wastegate line and run 45psi. There are plenty of boosted cars that run reliably for extended periods of time.

 

[NAKED MIKE]

omg! the insanity!