Front Drift Tires?

240SicknessX said:
keeping equal grip front and rear is safe.....
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Remember, there is psi to adjust as well. Run lower psi in the front, and a high psi in the back. Don't do more than what the psi recommendation on the tire is, because the tread block will fall off the tire the moment you spin the tire. I plan on running Ziex all around when I wear out the Azenis I am recieving from Ralph. Just adjust my driving to the tires, and play with psi settings.
 
Yeah Ziexs seem to get a bad rep. I've seen drifters make it to D1, get their pro FD license with those tires on, those tires are good not great but good. I will say if you can go RS2s or Rt-615s by all means do it but if your on a budget Ziexs are good, the new Ziexs coming out should be pretty good. I will say the Ziexs will teach you proper entry for sure, if you mess up a little you'll get understeer. If you have proper entry those tires are fine.
 
Uhoh,

I had to order tires by Tuesday morning, soo none of this was posted then. It was a buy two get two free deal at my old job & I get the tires for cost there. And the sale ended tuesday.

I orded Nitto INVO's 235/40/18

I have problems running crappy tires on my rears, and on front. Maybe it's just my driving style and I need to correct it. But whenever I run crappy tires, or to small tires on the rear my car is uncontrollable for the corners I want to drift. Mostly sequential turns like "S" turns where I have to keep a pretty good speed (about 40~50) and I consistently spin out with crappy tires. I decided to put good tires on it for one session (Nitto 555's in the front Pirelli sports in the back) and i could connect the corners almost every time. I have very good suspension.. and the RB is throwing out 290 at the wheels. I just don't really understand tires.

I have a pair of 17's that I can throw on the fronts to learn different initiation with. They are 205/40/17's Kumho 711's

Thanks for the help guys. Any more suggestions based on what I just said?
 
Well I have advice from a different perspective - to me, rear grip is more important.

Most guys I see running ultra-high grip tires (out front only) suck at driving and learn very little. They especially suck when it comes time to man up on the entries or complete a series of transitions. The idea behind drifting is not to have a twitchy, uncontrollable oversteer machine. YOU - the driver - are supposed to be inducing the oversteer through some technique. I know at the last event I did, I thought that the Michelin's I chose out back would offer some serious grip (they had a low 180 treadwear rating and were physically larger than my fronts) - instead I realized they were crap after the first run, especially when compared to the RT615's I was running out front. I had to drift like I was driving in rain - basically I was just pussy-foot'n around the track. mikespeed laughed, I cried. Personally I don't think that's a good way to learn.

So my advice to you is that if you're going to be running absolute garbage in the rear, run only a decent sport tire (at best) in the front. I would say just get something decent all around. Best way to learn IMO.
 
240SicknessX said:
Im going to be nice here and tell you if you blew out a set of rs-2's on the front of your rx-7 you are definitely doing something wrong. Think........ ur supposed to be burning the rear tires while drifting. Im sure your coil overs fixed the problem though.

i have 225 45 rs-2 on 9 wide front.
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but of course when they blew out i was in bad need of an alignment and my toe links were messed up both of my tires were pointed inwards like woah.
 
Tonymac said:
Well I have advice from a different perspective - to me, rear grip is more important.
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Well at one time when I was just starting to drift it was hard for me to loose traction in the rear, it sucked. So I ran 205s front and 195 rear tires. eventually I got good enough to where I could put the car sideways and control it with some steering effort, then I became consistent with my drifts, < 20% of the time id spin.

Dan told me to try a wider tire in the rear, said it gave him more control. So I mounted the 225s in the rear while keeping the 205's in the front, mind you still auto and very NA. I felt like someone slapped me back to elementary school. Ya so the learning process started over again. Added more power, added more grip and rear grip is where its at people. Of course you will probably have to go through the learning stages like I did but eventually realize that you need to force the car to drift, so you can concentrate on keeping the car drifting rather then keeping it from spinning out. End of story.

btw, I agree, super front grip and bald 195's is gay drift and dose not teach you anything.


^just for reference if anyone is wondering why staggered tires own..... they give you super human drifting powers.

ralph, i used kuhmo spt's at charolotte and they did not have 1\2 the grip my rs-2's did. I was used to the grip my rs-2s had. 340 tread wear........... pifft, more like 900 treadwear.
 
240SicknessX said:
ralph, i used kuhmo spt's at charolotte and they did not have 1\2 the grip my rs-2's did. I was used to the grip my rs-2s had. 340 tread wear........... pifft, more like 900 treadwear.
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i get you now...i havent drifted in a bit due to my car sucking at life, but as soon asi get back on the ground i am gonna see if i can still manage to ge the ziex's to hold the front down around a turn....another tire i want to try is the toyo t1r i heard they are decent grip and nice daily tires....
 
JeepsteR118 said:
i get you now...i havent drifted in a bit due to my car sucking at life, but as soon asi get back on the ground i am gonna see if i can still manage to ge the ziex's to hold the front down around a turn....another tire i want to try is the toyo t1r i heard they are decent grip and nice daily tires....
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a little more expensive.... but then again maybe you get what you pay for. It helps the rs-2's and 615's have attractive tread patterns, it just gives me peace of mind having a large contact patch.
 
240SicknessX said:
btw, I agree, super front grip and bald 195's is gay drift and dose not teach you anything.
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Which is pretty much what I'm talking about. I never ran ultra-high grip tires out front when I started drifting and I noticed myself improving much faster than other beginners who chose to run said tires. My first set of fronts were Toyo proxes in 215/45/17 while out back I had 205/45/17 Kuhmo Ecsta Supras. Different grip levels, but nothing so drastic as Azenis F and garbage R. After those tires, I ended up running ST115's on all 4, then ES100/ST115, then RS2/ES100, and now as high a gripping tire as I can afford out back. I just don't understand where novice drifters get the impression that RS2's, Azenis, or other ultra high grip tires are essential. It pains me to watch these guys at events b/c its only slowing their learning curve by running such ridiculous staggers.

IMO - If you want to get good, fast; run similar compound and size tires between the front and rear and unless you have gobs of power, start with some decent priced middle grade compound like the ES100 or FK452.
 
Ok. So the INVO's are one heck of a tire.

I am still in the learning stages. The call feels alot nicer with this set up. Drifting is alot more controllable too. I haven't gone to the Super Dori Link lately becase it's Finals week.

Thanks for all the help guys. Ya'll are confusing the crap out of me. But pretty much here is what I am getting.

The best way to learn how to initiate and understand drifting is to have a bald tire in the front and a semi-grippy-sport tire in the rear. That way I have to learn how to shift weight and inertia. It is not good to have a super grippy tire in the front and a non-grippy POS tire in the rear because it will be uncontrolable. (however, it is a good way to get used to being sideways when you first start learning). Staggered tires are the bomb... i don't know why. But thats just what you said.
 
Bald tires in the front? That's like a death setup! Just good tires all around.

I personally don't think its ever a good thing to have amazing tires out front with poop-spec tires out back - beginner or not. To me, you don't learn drifting that way.

Wider tires in the rear allow for more control while sliding. I think the biggest reason is their ability to cope with heat but I could be wrong. I think tire compound is more important than size (within reason).
 
Tonymac said:
Bald tires in the front? That's like a death setup! Just good tires all around.

I personally don't think its ever a good thing to have amazing tires out front with poop-spec tires out back - beginner or not. To me, you don't learn drifting that way.

Wider tires in the rear allow for more control while sliding. I think the biggest reason is their ability to cope with heat but I could be wrong. I think tire compound is more important than size (within reason).
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good stuff there, i think where you are tying to go is balance, a large bias in front traction over rear traction will cause the car to slide too easily and spin often.

with the same tires/sizes front and rear: assuming you never break traction with your front tires they will stay under static friction(most potential grip). While the rear tires are spinning they are under kinetic friction(this has less grip). Speaking strictly in terms of tires, at this point you have a front grip bias out of the exact same tire front and rear(there are other factors that can be involved). This is the basic idea why people run a staggered set up, in order to increase rear grip, while sliding, closer to that of your front grip. This allows better control over the car.

its all about balance while sliding, I run 205/50r15 Azenis 615 up front and inexpensive but non-shit tires in a 225/50r15 out back, and both are stretched because "spring loaded' side walls are the worst.
 
jtmroczk said:
good stuff there, i think where you are tying to go is balance, a large bias in front traction over rear traction will cause the car to slide too easily and spin often.

with the same tires/sizes front and rear: assuming you never break traction with your front tires they will stay under static friction(most potential grip). While the rear tires are spinning they are under kinetic friction(this has less grip). Speaking strictly in terms of tires, at this point you have a front grip bias out of the exact same tire front and rear(there are other factors that can be involved). This is the basic idea why people run a staggered set up, in order to increase rear grip, while sliding, closer to that of your front grip. This allows better control over the car.

its all about balance while sliding, I run 205/50r15 Azenis 615 up front and inexpensive but non-shit tires in a 225/50r15 out back, and both are stretched because "spring loaded' side walls are the worst.
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w0rd.

Larger tires out back means faster switch backs, it catches from spinning when you initiate hard, and your speed over the track is alot faster, which in tandem is badass being able to run up on someone or pull ahead. Larger tires last longer too!

im happy with a 225 200TW F and a 245 280TW R. Along with suspension technique bars which is setup for a under steer compared to stock bars. Im gonna want more rear grip soon, 235F, 255\265 rear.

note for the people who dont know: Stretched tires have a more gradual transition from grip to slip, which is more control. and they act less like a spring so feedback is more direct.
 
I've always noticed a (much) less gradual transion from grip to slip running stretched tires but the feedback is definitely far better.
 
sorry for reviving a year old thread but i have some questions... the 300zx is prone to oversteer because of the heavy front and novice driver, so i was running bald goodyear eagles (225) on the front with mich. pilots (235) on the rear.. front pressure being 20psi rear pressure being 40psi. Now i went from a lil over steer to a lot of understeer.. i have a mounted set of bfgoodrich gforce sports on my stock rims, i was going to mount them in the front and leave the pilots in the back and see what happens but the bfgoodrich's are brand new and im afraid the front is going to stick wayyyy to well causing ridiculous oversteer. should i run all 4 bfgoodrich with high pressure in the rear and slightly lower in the front? anyone feel like going for a ride tonite and offering some feedback?

note: i'm also running without p/s maybe understeer isnt so bad? :confused:
 
Bump the front tire pressure up to atleast 35 dude, 20 is so low you might debead the tire from it rolling over.

this isnt drag racing less pressure doesnt equal more grip atleast not while turning. Sidewall flex is bad and can be causeing alot of your understeer, also bald tires dont nessarly have more grip.
 
I run 40 psi front 60 psi rear which is really high but its what works for me. Theres a compressor at countlyine so you can try different tire pressures to see what suits your driving style. If your car has bad understeer def. dont try to drift the last turn till your happy ith the way its handeling or your gonna be kissing a k rail.
 
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